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Post by Zavi on Jul 27, 2010 9:35:25 GMT -5
While a decent amount of character development is awesome for any character, big or small, 83 minutes of Disney film doesn't really allow for that. And considering the historical context (pre-Naveen and even pre-Aladdin), compared to his predecessors Eric got some quality development. I think it even says in the commentary that the "thankless job" of animating the prince was done with some brilliant acting and solid development. I'll take that over white-horse-riding lovebirdies any day.
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Post by fathomsbelow on Aug 20, 2010 17:03:48 GMT -5
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Post by Aquisha on Aug 21, 2010 16:10:12 GMT -5
Speaking of Eric Look-Alikes, does anyone watch White Collar on USA? First it's really a great show with a fantastic ensemble, but second, Matt Bomer who plays the lead character, is just really, really, ridiculously good looking and, to me, he resembles our prince. Matt's features are a little more angular, but if you allow for the changes between reality and animation, I think he's a pretty good real-life interpretation of Eric.
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Aug 21, 2010 22:39:27 GMT -5
OH! Its been a while since I've seen Band of Brothers, but that guy is a cutie <3 Yes, I know of Mathew Boomer, Paige. He's a babe. And I agree about the animation thing. Cause really, Eric's eyes would be kind of freaking looking on a real person, so some exgeration works xD. He and Sean Maher look alike to me. I still have a soft spot for Sean Maher even though he's 35! Which I know he doesn't look that old, but he doesn't have much time to strap on the navy pants if Disney ever decided on it  |
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Post by WickedElphie on Sept 15, 2010 22:49:40 GMT -5
Paige I actually showed Jodi a picture of Matthew Boomer and Tim Daly from an appearence on the Today Show and went "Look! Modern!Eric!" We're all just scarily in sync.
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Sept 20, 2010 20:02:52 GMT -5
LOL, yes, I love that picture.
Anyhoot. We've discussed other possible love interests for him and even Disney friends. But what about dynamic was would you like to see him played against (doesn't have to be romantic). I had a idea where Meg was his older sister, and I ended up really liking it. So I guess I like him interacting with really out-going/assertive girls. I also love the dynamics Jess and I have played out with him when it comes to Mozenrath and Norrington. I loved when I had the chance to rp him with Beasty in mod times. I dunno, I just see him as kind of the "Mark" to each one's "Roger" (Rent reference ftw!!)
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Post by Zavi on Sept 21, 2010 12:31:09 GMT -5
So while this is very, very, VERY biased, I'd love to see more interactions with him and Ursula/Vanessa. While they're far less varied than, say, Ariel and Ursula, it'd be interesting to see him react to her both a) before he knew she hurt Ariel and b) afterward, like the film events lead. He and Jim might have a cool big brother/fatherson dynamic too. So I just came from my art class and we were talking about shape/line and how to assign a "feeling" to it. Being the fangirl that I am, I referenced a lot of character design notes from Disney and how their shapes/lines/colors hint at character. Ariel's full of complements--straights/curves, red/green which suggests lots of energy and a generally dynamic, daredevil happy vibe with those big eyes of hers. Ursula's both black and purple, the inherently-darkest color in the spectrum, and she's full of curves and arches. We know something about her character from just how she looks. So after that class I went back to my dorm and realized that I didn't know how this applied to our boy. So I looked at some screenshots and tried to find out. His design is pretty similar to most Disney princes before him, but he's got enough unique features. Some broad distinctions Jess and I came up with: -Clothes (I could go on this a lot more, but I have three minutes to spare  ) -Shoulder-line (similar to a lot of Disprinces, but I noticed it a lot with him) -Less exaggerated shape (he looks the most human out of most everybody in the film) -Stance (vs. Grim especially) I've seen a whooole lot of character design notes for Ariel, but I've never come across any for Eric. So whether these are a) Eric-specific b) Prince-specific or c) Completely unintentional or d) Part of the specific animator's style I don't know, but I'm gonna try and post some screenshots or something so I can try to see how he's constructed, visually. |
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Post by faya27 on Sept 28, 2010 14:55:54 GMT -5
Okay, I'm looking up colors on the internet right now. I found a website that tells meanings of colors that could help us understand Eric's color design. crystal-cure.com/color-meanings.htmlBased on Eric's color design, read the color meanings about black, white, red, and blue. |
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Post by Coral on Sept 29, 2010 12:34:40 GMT -5
The website doesn't work for me. |
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Sept 29, 2010 22:38:42 GMT -5
Here ya go Rachel!
Red symbolizes: action, confidence, courage, vitality
Blue symbolizes: youth, spirituality, truth, peace
Black symbolizes: Death, earth, stability
White symbolizes: Purity, Cleanliness
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Post by WickedElphie on Sept 30, 2010 9:56:31 GMT -5
Also, this isn't on the site but red also has a connotation of passion and love (think red roses and our girl's hair.)
And white also tends tor present innocence (which is similar to purity but different enough to warrant a mention.)
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Post by Coral on Sept 30, 2010 12:27:29 GMT -5
Very fitting color choices for our man's clothes. His passion is there, it's just hidden deep within him.
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Sept 30, 2010 20:04:39 GMT -5
@mare. I remember watching the documentary about TLM with Alyssa Milano talking about how the artists were striving for the characters to look like real people, and not just pretty pictures. Not to bag on the prior princes but Eric was the first one to not look like a Ken doll. He's the first one to have those really big eyes, and to have blue ones too.
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Post by Coral on Oct 1, 2010 11:05:43 GMT -5
I still think Eric is the best looking one out of them all. But I'm pretty sure we all think that...
I've never seen the Alyssa Milano documentary.
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Post by Zavi on Oct 2, 2010 21:08:56 GMT -5
So soooomebody had a little too much time on her hands today. I was gonna do more for Ariel and Ursula, but I figured I need to more productive things. And I apologize in advance for the image-heavy post: if anyone is bothered or this stretches your page, I'd be glad to post links instead. And a lot of this is general character appeal/art stuff, but I figured I'd point the obvious things out anyway. And I fail at drawing, so if anyone more inclined than I am has anything artsy to point out, please do.  -Dynamic neckline. We see this outfit on Eric for most of the film, and we know it as his sailing outfit since he's, well, sailing when we first see him in it. We get the first impression of him as a sailor more than a prince, as opposed to his predecessors, who were either out in the palace or after the girl. -General clothing. I'm not sure if color symbolism comes into play with his outfit, since it's pretty common sailor/work garb, but I guess it works out. Red and blue aren't exactly complements but since his pants grey out in a lot of lighting I like the dynamic feel the red cummerbund gives him. It always adds some life to an otherwise normal outfit. -And awww, come on. He's got an arm around his puppy. -There isn't that much of an exaggerated shape to his body (see Ariel or Grimsby, or most of the secondary characters.) I know Eric's animator--whose name slips my mind at the moment--was praised for his superb acting on the part of our boy, and I love that just because he looks so *human*. You don't get an overarching feel from his shape like you would with Ariel or Ursula. He's just a person, and you get a lot of his character from movement, dialogue, and subtleties.  -Is it just me, or does that statue remind anyone else of Captain Morgan? It's obviously not accurate to Eric at all, with that massive sword and the straights the body forms, etc. -I was trying to compare the shapes of each of the characters, but Eric's legs are always over the place so I can't really see how he's constructed. Max is of course a fluffy ball of circles (lots of 'em usually give a feel of playfulness or happiness, like bubbles or balloons, and of course round = cuddly). Grimsby is an elegant hourglass, thin and sophisticated, and stable. Certainly a lot less masculine than Eric, who can't seem to stand with his legs together. The only time you see that is when he's under Vanessa's spell and (I think) when he gets married. Generally when you want to convey movement or energy in drawings, varying the position of the legs creates that energy. And of course it's a typical man-stance.  -1st impression of Eric = "Isn't this great? The salty sea-air, the wind blowing in your face...." 1st impression of Phillip: Giving Aurora a gift, I know you, I walked with you once...1st Impression of Charming: Oh, come on. He doesn't have a *name.* 1st Impression of Snow White's Prince: See above. We see him wander around and sing to Snow White. I didn't count sequels/future movies since they came around after Eric and could take influence from what he started. We meet our hero BEFORE we even *see* our heroine. There's no influence from the love interest, no buildup of character based on their relation to their love interest. We meet Eric and Ariel separately, so their characters are formed without the influence from each other. Eric is a sailor before he's ever a prince, enjoying the weather and having a good time. He's the youngest and most energetic on the ship, except for Max, of course. Love isn't on his mind--he just wants to sail as much as he can on the perfect day. -Again with the dynamic neckline and a very strong line of action. Contrast with his wedding/Vanessa outfits, where the buttons let your eye follow down his body in a straight line. -The rigging creates a natural frame with dynamic diagonals, drawing attention to him rather than Max. But of course this movie isn't about him.   And of course I can't sit here and not compare our boy with Ariel. Of course there's a whole lotta contrast between exaggerated masculine and exaggerated feminine. Lotsa obvious stuff here, but I'll say anyway: -Compare the shoulder lines--you can't see it as much in this picture, since Eric is turned, but when they're together you can see the difference. -Hand sizes. Eric's hands are massive compared to Ariel's, of course. You can see it here and in Kiss the Girl, but not nearly as much in the screenshots of the wedding I saw. Might just be an animator's difference but I thought it was worth noting. -Eye color. Both blue, but Eric's eyes are much icier (sky-blue, anyone?) than Ariel's (sea-blue?). -The physical contact and the eye contact guides your eye through both of these guys. You might stop to read the eyes, but generally the flow doesn't stop at one or end at the other. -Wedge/curve shape in Ariel--the sail dress lets her have the mer-tail curves even when she has legs. |
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Post by Coral on Oct 2, 2010 21:45:18 GMT -5
Wow! What an awesome analysis, Mare.
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Post by faya27 on Oct 14, 2010 1:41:09 GMT -5
Wow, Coral! You have been doing your homework!!
That was a really great analysis on our sailor boy!
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Post by WickedElphie on Feb 24, 2011 1:44:53 GMT -5
Agreed that Mare's analysis is spot-on.
So here's a question-in a hypothetical situation where one or both of his parents had been deeply flawed in some way, what do you think those flaws might be? I could see Dad maybe being very rigid about adherence to duty and station whereas if it was Mom I could see her maybe being very interested in the trappings of society, or perhaps simply unhappy for various reasons, and while loving her son, not being able to provide a stable source of comfort and security.
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Post by Coral on Feb 24, 2011 15:34:49 GMT -5
Fatal flaws... Now there's a loaded topic! I can see his father having been very dismissive and critical of him. That could fuel his love for the sea because he could get away from all of that and just be somewhere where he's accepted for who he is. I've always gotten the impression he's more at home with the sailors than in court. Where one or both parents were critical of him, the sailors were accepting and encouraging. And try as I might, I just can't imagine his mother having been in his life for very long. Hence my idea of what really happened to his mom. (and now this thread is making me want to get that back out! Happy? ) My fic idea aside, I think she would have loved him dearly, but maybe been totally unprepared for the realities of being a queen and a mother. Balancing the duties of being a queen with those of motherhood would not be an easy task, and she'd never get the balance right. One duty would always suffer. |
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Post by WickedElphie on Mar 11, 2011 13:25:42 GMT -5
My impression of Eric is that he definitely didn't have a lot of experience being part of a traditional family unit, at least not the kind that would have offered the support you would expect.
For example I've always maintained that Eric has a low sense of self-worth, regarding himself as a person, not the prince. The way he jumps head first into danger, putting other people's lives above his own, and especially going back for Max feed into that for me.
Another thing is, we can be reasonably sure, as of TLM that Eric has no living siblings (that he knows about, any way). But what if at one point he had an elder brother who was expected to take the throne, who then died young? That would definitely account for Eric being more comfortable in his role as a civilian and a sailor than as prince.
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